Talk With Your Teen About Sextortion: a Tip Sheet for Parents: 

https://cybersafetycop.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/talk-about-sextortion-for-parents-English-.pdf

Cyber Safety Cop Website: 

https://www.cybersafetycop.com/

OurPact App

Sign up for 1-year and get an additional month for free

https://app.ourpact.com/signup/cybersafetycop

National Center for Missing and Exploited Children: website

Take It Down: Take It Down is a free service that can help you remove or stop the online sharing of nude, partially nude, or sexually explicit images or videos taken of you when you were under 18 years old

Clayton's Book: Amazon Link

Just a note about today's episode. Due to the nature of the content and discussion, I'm going to recommend that you do a first listen on your own. Some of what gets covered is content that deserves its own time for discussion, and you're going to want to approach it deliberately in conversation with your children while you may want to use this episode as a conversation starter, I recommend you hear all of the content first. Thank you. 

My guest today is the founder of Cyber Safety Cop, as a retired sergeant from the Orange County Sheriff's Department and previous school resource officer, juvenile investigator and Behavioral Threat Assessor, he is one of the nation's leading law enforcement educators on a variety of topics. Welcome to Healthy Screen Habits, Clay Cranford.

Clay Cranford: (01:37)

Thank you, Hillary.

Hillary Wilkinson: (01:39) 

So, Clay, you spent a career working with kids and teens, what led you to create your current role as cyber safety cop?

Clay Cranford: (01:52)

Yeah, it was the best part of my career was working with students. I was a school resource officer in the early 2000 tens, which, was an interesting time to be working with teens because that, uh, the early 2000 tens is when children, uh, moved, uh, their lives online on social media and, and mobile devices, smartphones. And at also, at the same time, that's when, uh, vaping devices also showed up on school campuses. So it, it changed things radically. And, uh, I noticed, uh, that parents were not, uh, well equipped to deal with these issues. And these are not issues that like we, as, you know, parents ever had to cons be concerned about, and no one had to talk to us about. So, um, it was, it was a, it was a transition time, uh, in, in, in our kind of culture and our children's culture.

Clay Cranford: (02:41)

I was seeing just a lot of really sad, horrible outcomes from some of the, you know, decisions that children were making online and who they're connecting with, et cetera. So it all boiled down to two things. A a good kid who made a bad choice, and a parent who did not know what was going on. But if they had, they could have done something about it. So I, I, I do feel like, um, parents are overwhelmed. I just, I want to give them the tools and resources to make a radical difference in their child's digital world and, and perhaps make a change in this trajectory of our children's mental health. Um, our children's mental health is collapsing, anxiety, depression, and I think technology, uh, mobile devices have a lot to do with this.

Hillary Wilkinson: (03:36)

Yeah. Yeah. No, I think, I mean, I, I feel like I'm every time I've been talking about,  I really love the, the cyber safety cop name. And so I've been telling everybody that I got to talk to you today. And I was, I was telling my sister, I am, I'm gonna be very sad if he doesn't show up in like, full robot regalia, which, you know, as a podcast, I can tell you he's not. Okay. . But, but that being said, I really appreciate you coming at this from a very education based standpoint, because I firmly believe thateducation saves lives. And I think that is what you are doing with the work that you are doing. So you kind of traded one, one role of hero for another, and yet still doesn't wear a cape. I can still see him, and he is not, he's not

Clay Cranford: (04:32)

Wearing no capes, capes, , no capes that

Hillary Wilkinson: (04:34)

From, uh, no capes, no robot costume. Come on, Clay, what's

Clay Cranford: (04:37)

Going on? Robot costume would be amazing. I'll look into that.

Hillary Wilkinson: (04:40)

So I'm joking. But the reason why I really wanted to connect with you is a very, very serious threat that is hitting a primary target that is right where most of our listenership falls. The FBI is warning parents, caregivers, and teens about increased sextortion crimes across the country. There are some people that like, have never even heard this word before, sextortion. So can we just start with a definition of what is it?

Clay Cranford: (05:25)

Yeah. So, uh, it is a, a kind of scam where the, um, the suspect gets a, uh, it could be an adult as well, but in this case, we're gonna be talking about, uh, children to share some sexually explicit material with them, and usually do that by, you know, kind of coercing them, maybe maybe making them think that they're also someone that age and they're, um, exchanging, you know, nude images back and forth, and it's all happening online and it seems very risk, you know, free kind of, um, thing. But once they have that image, then they have a couple of choices. The, the, the, the fastest growing part of this is asking for money. So they're extorting that person or money and saying, if you don't send me, you know, $500 or whatever, I'm gonna, I'm gonna share this image with everybody, you know.

Clay Cranford: (06:16)

And, um, so that's one aspect. The other aspect is, uh, um, asking for more child sex abuse material. So they'll basically, it'll be the, the same threat.” I'll share this with everyone, you know, unless you go online and make a video for me, uh, once a week for the rest of your life.” Um, and, and when kids are faced with this, they don't see a way out. We need to talk to our kids that there is a way outta this, but we we're just, we're seeing this at epidemic levels, the FBI's right. To warn parents about it. And, um, I literally today, uh, got an email this morning from a parent saying, usually it's an cryptic email. Um, “I have a problem. I saw you a year ago, uh, at my kid's school.

Clay Cranford: (07:04)

Can, can I talk to you?” And so,” yeah, sure.” And, uh, I called, she called me up this morning and her high school daughter, age daughter, broke up with her boyfriend, very sad and dejected and lonely. And she goes online looking for love and acceptance. She wants someone to say that she's lovely and special. And she met a person online who did that for her. And part of that was for her to share a nude image with him, which she did. And then, and then came the, the extortion. So our kids are just super vulnerable and, um, this, this problem's not gonna go away because many of the perpetrators are in other countries, not the United States, and we don't have a legal way of stopping them.

Hillary Wilkinson: (07:49)

I, like you hear from many different parents who have either been directly affected by extortion or have, you know, have a friend and um, one of the things that I was, uh, really made aware of is there are lots and lots of families, we'll say, oh, we talk to our kids about, you know, not communicating with people they don't know online and all of these things. And one of the ways that I have found that is a tricky way that the perpetrators can kind of get into these inner circles is they will find say a school, a middle school in the area, and they will start, friending people within that school. And what the kids are doing is they're using that kind of friending network, so to speak, as a vetting agent. Mm-Hmm. . So that's how they, they'll look and they'll say, “oh, well I don't know this person, but they're friends with, you know, A, B, C, and D friend of mine, so I'm sure it's okay.” And so, and that's how, and I mean, I understand how it happens. I mean, I, I most likely would've done the same thing. 

Clay Cranford: (09:13)

Yeah, this, this, this tactic that they're using, uh, and your 1000000% are correct. Uh, they, they, they get into these networks, but also that what, that's what makes their threat really devastating. 'cause they're friended in. And now, um, they have that threat. Like, I'm, I could just DM everybody, you know, uh, with this image. And, and then once, then the, you know, I'm talking to a parent and they're like, well, what do we do? I'm like, well, don't pay number one. Uh, and number two, you need to block that person. But then they're like, well, what do we do with all the friends of my child who are connected with this person already? Like, what, how do we alert them? Like, do we tell them that my child was a, a victim? So my child doesn't want to like, let anybody know that this happened to 'em? 'cause it's very embarrassing and personal. So like, there's like, what, what do we do? Like there's this person still connected to all these, all these children at this school. We need to let these children know somehow. So it, it's just, it's complicated and, um, it's super under-reported. And frankly, even when you do report it there, there's not a whole lot that can be done if that person is doing this from, you know, on the other side of the planet.

Hillary Wilkinson: (10:25)

Sure, sure. I almost wonder if there's a way that you could, um, I don't know, screenshot the, or the name and image of the account and send it to say, you know, a parent run account of just recognize that this is a fraudulent account. This person is known to be dangerous to minors. Mm-Hmm. or something along those lines. And I,

Clay Cranford: (10:53)

I, yeah, and you can't, and you can flag the account to the, the, the hosting site to Instagram or Snapchat and say, yeah, this, this person's extorting me. So, I mean, they can get those things taken out, but, but we're talking about a ring, right? It's not just one person. Like there's entire warehouses of people literally in, in a, in some country and there's 40, 50 people just banging out messages to kids, uh, around the clock. And so, um, yeah, once you shut down one account, then there's, it's like Hydra, there's, there's, you know, 50 in their place.

Hillary Wilkinson: (11:28)

Well, thanks Clay. I hadn't thought about that. .

Clay Cranford: (11:32)

It's grim. This gets worse. It's really grim. 

Hillary Wilkinson: (11:34)

This gets worse than I even

Clay Cranford: (11:35)

Realized. well's. It's actually Hillary, it's actually worse than that. Because what parents don't understand is, well, there's a lot we don't understand. Number one is, um, you've got a great kid, you've got a lovely child who in the real world would never do this. They, they would never share their personal information, let alone a nude image with, with this person. They would never do that. But online it's a totally different ballgame this thing that parents have, which is, you know, I have, I've talked to my kid about it. I, I have a parent call me and she's like, Clay, she goes, just so you understand. She goes, my son, he's a high school. Uh, I think he was a senior at this time. She goes, my son sat in your presentation. You talked about this, you talked about sextortion, we talked about Sextortion in, in our, in our high school presentation.

Clay Cranford: (12:30)

I went to your parent talk and you talked to me about it. And we went home and I talked to my son and he and I looked each other in the eye and we said, and he said to me, I would, mom, I would never do that in a million years. She goes, I found him in the fetal position crying in his room. She's like, this boy is like 6 3/240. He's like a gonna be a D one lacrosse player, whatever. He's gonna get like a full scholarship. He's a, he's a, he's a stud. And she's like, I have my man child is crying on the floor because this person is saying, if you don't gimme a thousand dollars, I'm gonna destroy your life. And it wasn't just like one message, it was message after message. And it was, it was not just like, I'm just your life, but people are gonna find out how, just how gross you are and how dirty you are.

Clay Cranford: (13:13)

Your mom and dad won't love you anymore. Your friends will leave you. Like, it's, it's this, this pressure and the shame that our children cannot bear this. And she said, she goes, I thought, and I, I never thought in a million years, number one, he would do this. Number two, that he wouldn't feel safe to come to me. 'cause we've talked about this. He went to all his friends at school and tried to bum money off of them to pay the extorter. And he, and he scraped together like $72. And he told this person, I only, I'm a kid, I only have $72. And he's like, well, I'm, then you, then you should kill yourself. That's what this person said to him. 

Hillary Wilkinson:

And that's what's happening. 

Clay Cranford:

And that's what's happening's. She, after dealing with this situation, you know, kind of deescalating the whole thing with her son, she said, he told me if I hadn't helped him, if the mom hadn't found him, he, he told his mom, I think I might have taken my own life. Oh. So our kids do not have the emotional assets and the life experience to deal with this. Now. I mean, they're gonna make bad choices. They're little beautiful, little prefrontal cortexes aren't great, but, um, but what do you do? Right? We need to make resilient kids. 'cause we can't just assume they're always gonna make a good choice. 'cause they won't, they need to know what to do, right. If this happens to them.

Hillary Wilkinson: (14:36)

Right. And when we come back, let's talk more about some of those strategies for educating our kids about sextortion and what to do if it happens in your family.

Ad Break - 988

Hillary Wilkinson:

I'm speaking with Clay Cranford, founder of Cyber Safety Cop, an organization whose mission is striving to create and promote safe schools, healthy children, and empowered families. So one of the things that I think is so very tricky about talking about sextortion is we often don't even know, like, how do we start this conversation? Where do we begin? Do you have like topics or tips or anything about starting this conversation with their kids?

Clay Cranford: (16:27)

Yes. In fact, I, um, and I'll, I'll share the link with you, but, uh, maybe come in the show notes, but I do have a, like, parent handout. You know, how to talk about this with your kid. But basically, number one, parents, like, you have to accept that this could happen to your kid. So just, you know, let, let's just like embrace that , I'm, I'm a parent of two boys who are now in college, but I was under no illusion like that, that, that, you know, there's no special force field around my home. Um, just because their dad's, uh, doing this work. It, it can happen to anyone. So once we're past that, the number two, you just, you need to sit down with your kid and just have an honest conversation with them. And that honest conversation begins with, Hey, like, there's a lot of pressure out there, there's stuff that's going on.

Clay Cranford: (17:12)

Um, and you need to know that there are people that seem to be a nice person or someone your age, and they are looking to get you to compromise yourself to send them an image that you'd be embarrassed about, um, if someone else were to see it. And I, and, and frankly, I don't think there's any point in mincing words. I think we need to talk to our kids, especially younger than maybe you think you need to. Um, and, and maybe with the, with our younger kids, we should have a conversation about what kind of images do we share, period. Right? I'm sure every parent has had a conversation with their kid about, you know, who can see your body, right? Like the parts of your body under your, um, bathing suit. Like the only people who can see that are like mom and dad or the doctor, you know, like, you have that conversation.

Clay Cranford: (17:59)

And then, but like we're talking about images now, like what, you know, at a certain age, you might say you're not allowed to share any image of yourself with anyone without my, my express permission, but maybe at a certain age where you give them a phone and they can take images of themselves. We need to talk about what images are Ok. You know, things that aren't, you know, suggestive or sexually explicit or, or, you know, revealing. Those are things that we need to not share. But then we talk to, especially our teenagers who are dating, we need to talk about sexting. So nearly 20% of 18 year olds have said, “I sent a nude image to another person.” So this is absolutely happening. Not everybody's doing it, but 20% still a big number. And you, and you need to talk about, you know, sharing that image with another person that, you know, you share that image with a boyfriend or girlfriend.

Clay Cranford: (18:47)

Um, I, I do this in my presentation to high schoolers and middle schoolers, and I usually get a big laugh from the kids because I ask them, you know, whoever you're dating in high school, is that someone you're gonna be with the rest of your life? And the answer's “no”. And, you know, I'll have a, a gymnasium full of like 800 kids or something, and I'll say, “Hey, I don't wanna ruin the romance, but it's not gonna work out like, whoever you're dating right now, you're all gonna break up sooner or later. But, you know, it doesn't break up that image.” Mm-Hmm. . And so if that image, and especially if those breakups aren't the best, you know, could that person use that image or share that image, perhaps maybe to get back at you or maybe to humiliate you or, or just maybe just casually share it with somebody, then it gets out the point is it, it like that could, you know, cause reputation, cons, et cetera.

Clay Cranford: (19:34)

And I'll ask the students, I go, have you ever heard of this happening? And I'll have 800 heads bobbing up and down, like, yeah, yeah, we know that happens. Mm-Hmm. . So if we know that happens and we know this relationship’s not gonna last forever, it doesn't make sense to share that image with somebody. And, and of course sitting in that gymnasium looking at me with, with their peers, they're gonna be like, absolutely not that I, that doesn't make sense at all. The problem is, when they're online, right. When there's no one else around and they're feeling that pressure, you know, that's, that's the problem, right? That, that's, that's when those decisions are made. And then let's talk about sharing that image with a complete stranger. So I have two boys, and I sat down with my boys, um, individually, and we talked about this.

Clay Cranford: (20:15)

And the, the boys are more likely to be victims of the stranger sexting than, than girls. Although girls are still victims. Um, girls are victimized by people they know. Right? They're sharing that image with somebody now in a relationship. But with boys, I'm like, look, I told my boys straight up, you know what, you meet some online, they're, they send you a nude image and they ask you to reciprocate. Mm-Hmm, . I go, I just wanna be really, really clear man to man. Nobody wants to see a clinical closeup of your, of your business. Nobody wants to see that. And my boys are kind of laughing. They're like, okay, dad. I'm like, no serious- if you do that, there's only one reason why someone would ask you for that because they want to trap you. That's the trap. So you need to understand what the trap looks like, and then what happens next is this bombardment of horrible things.

Clay Cranford: (21:13)

And they're gonna try to convince you that if you were to tell me that I wouldn't love you anymore. And I go, I gotta tell you something. There's nothing you can do that would stop me from loving you. And I go, in fact, I don't want you to go through something like this yet by yourself. If you made a mistake and you did something that you're really embarrassed about or, or you're, you're just, you know, you don't, you, you think you can't tell anyone, you can come tell me and I will help you. The second thing after that, I told my boys, if it was something you couldn't tell me, if you felt like I just can't tell my mom or dad, it's so bad. Is there an adult maybe at your school that you could tell? Is there another adult in your life that you trust and respect your coach?

Clay Cranford: (21:57)

Somebody hat you could go to? If it wasn't me, is there another person? And they're like, yes. I'm like, okay, great. I go, you just have to tell someone. And we never gonna, we're never gonna pay these people. We're never gonna do that. And if we make a mistake, it can happen. You gotta come and ask for help. So that's the resilient piece. We need kids to know that under the worst case scenario that we're not gonna do, we're not gonna take everything away. I told my boys, if you make a mistake, I'm not gonna take your phone away if I can. 

Hillary Wilkinson: (22:28)

Yeah. Right. Yeah. And I think I, you know, so often the phone gets used as the, um, the power play between, between parents and teens. And so, but in doing that, you're also putting your kid because that is their, their social lifeline. And we all know that developmentally kids at that stage, their social structures are more important than anything else. I mean, that is their currency in which they are dealing. And if we're threatening to take that away, we are essentially putting them in a place where they can't help but lie to, to keep it. And so I, um, I understand what you're saying. I, um, out of all of what you said, my two takeaways are, we have to explicitly set our kids up to expect to be told that your parents are going to desert you. Which is, I mean, I can't think of a greater fear. And for you to preempt that by saying, there is nothing anyone can do that, or there's nothing that you can do that will stop me from loving you. I think that is so powerful. And my second takeaway is “clinical closeup of your business”. . I, I love that phrase. Yeah. I've usually said a picture of your junk. So, you know, I like clinical closeup .

Clay Cranford: (24:07)

Yeah. It's, it's, I told my boys, I'm like, I don't care how attractive you think you are, nobody, nobody who wants to see that. So Yeah. I mean, and, and the thing is that, you know, that the screens just completely, strip away any sense of consequence, right? Yes. You're not looking at other human being. And so it just makes, and and that's why, like, I have parents who, who look at their kid after something like this and they're like, “I don't even know you. Like, how, like, how could you do this?” And, um, yeah, you're, you're parents. If, if you're that parent, you're in great company because there's a lot of kids who've blown their parents' minds. Um, we did, uh, when we were kids. Mm-Hmm. . But, but the, the stakes were very different, right? Right. And if, and if you survived, if you survived whatever horrible thing you did, then it was like a learning lesson, right?

Clay Cranford: (24:58)

Like, you, you drove too fast and you almost crashed. And your parents found out about, you know, whatever, like you borrowed the car when you shouldn't have like, those kinds of things like we did when we were kids. But today, kids are making choices online that have this like, ongoing relentless, um, impact. And, couple this with their mental health issues. So you have a kid who's struggling with anxiety and depression, they're doing this partially to, to feel good about themselves, um, a lot of times. And then having this crushing, you know, attack of, of their, of of their, you know, personhood and their relationships. And it's, and it's too much. It's too much for most any kid, but, but it, yeah, like we said, it, it'll push kids over the edge.

Clay Cranford: (25:51)

I was a keynote speaker at a, Internet Crimes Against Children Conference, uh, last fall. And, uh, one of the, one of the panelists that came up and spoke after me, um, sh her, her, she's from northern California, her son, great kid, um, sent a new, shared a nude image with a, a stranger at 10:00 PM uh, by 6:00 AM the morning he was, he was gone. He took his own life. And, um, when, when she was up there telling the story, I mean, I just, I, I just remember my hair standing up on end. I just felt a little sick, my stomach. And, um, and we've, we, we actually flew home together on an airplane after the conference I was sitting chatting with her at, in the airport. And I go, “you described to me really the best case scenario. You had a kid who knew what was right and wrong. You had a great relationship with 'em, you talked about this and, and it still happened.”

Hillary Wilkinson: (26:51)

Yeah.

Clay Cranford: (26:52)

What she didn't have was anything that would alert her if her kid was in trouble. So, so one other important piece is I I highly recommend, um, that you install an app on your child's phone that, that would alert you if they're getting sextorted.

Clay Cranford: (27:31)

Uh, the one that, um, I'm, I'm excited about actually is called OurPact, O-U-R-P-A-C-T. Okay. And the cool thing about it, it actually uses IOS's, um, device management system. So it's the same kind of management system that an employer would ins, like activate on a employee's phone. So it has that kind of baked in with the operating system. But it does  a couple interesting things. One is that it helps you easily regulate screen time, uh, in a way that's like super simple. In fact, the parent that, that talked to me today about her daughter, um, her, she'd given her daughter access to Snapchat, which I don't recommend any parent ever giving their child Snapchat. Um, but she did, even after seeing my presentation, I'm very clear about this. She gave her child, you know, access to a couple hours a day, and then she gave her more access.

Clay Cranford: (28:22)

And, and that's how this relationship, this is how that connection happened, was through Snapchat. She goes, well, what do I do? She goes, now that she's, I deleted Snapchat, but she can re-download it anytime that she wants. So OurPact will actually block that from being used on your child's phone even after they've approved the downloads. So that's nice. Also, it takes screenshots of what your child's doing on their phone periodically, and then it runs it through a, um, optic, uh, optical character recognition. And then if is, if it sees words that are dangerous, then it'll send you a, a notification. So that's something you can do on an iPhone. Again, like your kid's, your kid's gonna make mistakes. Um, you, you just as a parent need to know, you need to be able to step in and intercede in a situation where your child maybe doesn't feel like they're in control.

Hillary Wilkinson: (29:27)

Right. Right. So you mentioned that, um, this individual had reached, um, via Snapchat, not Mm-Hmm. not surprising at all. We, recommend a never hold on Snapchat, but how are perpetrators generally reaching kids? Is it direct messages through social media? Is it gaming? Is it texting direct? How, how are they getting to them?

Clay Cranford: (29:56)

The answer's yes. , it's all those things. But you, but you know, the trajectory towards sending that image, you know, it could, it could be really easy. It could be really fast, right? It could be, I've had kids who were, um, friended somebody on Instagram and immediately get a DM with a nude image. Mm-Hmm. like, boom. Like, send me, if you want more of me, send me one of you and boys. Um, and, and this kind of ties in with pornography actually.

Clay Cranford: (30:44)

So I think part of this is, uh, basically hacking a young man's mind, which is already kind of dopamine seeking for that kind of visual stimuli, right. Pornography, and basically saying, “I'm gonna provide some pornography for you, but all you need to do is, is to give me an image of you and we're good. Right? Like, that's, and, and you don't know me, I don't know you, like, what could go wrong?” And that's kind of how they're thinking about it. So it could, it could be really fast, you know, other than that, I mean, it may just, it may take a day or two. It may not take that long 'cause 'cause the boys are very impulsive. Again, they're pornographic image seeking. And so it's really, now girls, it's gonna take a little while longer because it's typically more relational type of thing happening here.

Clay Cranford: (31:35)

Hmm. So, um, the private messages, the DMs, the texting, things that are away from other eyeballs are, are typically where this is happening. So they may meet somebody on Instagram or Snapchat. And then, and then the que the requests, the, the, all that stuff's happening where you can't see if you're just following, if you're just following your child on Instagram, you, you don't see the DMs. Right? Right. You don't see the private messages.  My boys had Instagram, I had logged in as them on my phone so I could see their dms. Mm-Hmm. . So there, there's some ways around this, but you know, when you have something that's sending and receiving self-destructing images, like on Snapchat Mm-Hmm.

Clay Cranford: (32:29)

Like, there, there's no way for you to manage that Mom and Dad. You, you, you just don't know. And, um, Snapchat also has this quick add, right? Where you can quickly add followers, and these are people who are friends and friends of friends and farther out. So Snapchat is facilitating complete strangers into your child's life. Mm-Hmm. . And, and they're kind of just shoving. They're just constantly shoving that in your kid's face. And your child's like, well, if I, if if more people, you know, more popular I am, and all the things that are good about that, um, is, is is a lie, frankly. And, um, and again, you can't, you can't turn that off. There's no parental control for that, except for deleting that app. And it's by

Hillary Wilkinson: (33:09)

Phone,

Clay Cranford: (33:10)

It's by design. It,

Hillary Wilkinson: (33:10)

It's by design. The parental control apps that are out there are not able to access those things within social media feeds. And I think that gets by a lot of people as well. So let's go to the deep dark place of “it's happened”. And let's just say our kid has done the right thing by letting us know. And I would imagine that the first thing you're gonna say is to be calm….I gotta tell you,

Clay Cranford: (33:40)

Remain calm. 

Hillary Wilkinson: (33:41)

Exactly. That is not my forte . So I have kind of like a self-regulation question to ask, because all of you first responder guys always have this like, amazing gift of staying calm in the face of a storm. So what, what steps do you recommend that we we do to stay calm?

Clay Cranford: (34:00)

To, to remain calm? Okay. So like, this is a real thing. So it's your breath. All right. Okay. And, and, and, um, you can actually physiologically change your body just based on how you breathe. So if you were to hyperventilate, you'll feel anxious. Um, so, so the point here is that you're gonna slow down your breathing. You're gonna breathe in through your nose, hold it for a moment, and then breathe it out slowly and do that a few times. And you're gonna feel better. Your, your, your blood pressure's gonna drop down your, your heart rate is gonna drop down. This is something that we do in law enforcement. Um, when you're entering a situation that is chaotic and you need to remain calm, I consciously would, would be doing this. Um, people in the military special forces,

Clay Cranford: (34:50)

they do it too. So it does work. Um, and yeah, the, the promise before this happens is, if you come to me, kiddo, I promise I'm not gonna berate you. Right. And I'm not gonna flip out and I'm not gonna judge you. So you have to be, you have to be good to your promise. And so you do need to remain calm. And, um, you know, and you may cry. That's okay. Uh, you can't stop that. But, you know, um, you know, you, you remain calm. And, and then you, and then the next thing is you, you hug and thank your kid, say, “Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you for coming to me. I love you.” And, and touching them and holding them and hugging them like that for them, like helps their anxiety. 'cause it releases dopamine in their brain. And, um,

Hillary Wilkinson: (35:32)

Oxytocin,

Clay Cranford: (35:33)

Oxytocin and all that. Mm-Hmm. . Yes. So, so that's really, really important though. If you're sitting far away from your kid when they're telling you this, they feel like they're on their own. So, so, you know, hug your kid, hold 'em for a moment, just tell 'em it's gonna be okay. And then, um, and then say, “okay, just tell me what's going on. Just, just, just tell me.” And I wouldn't be asking a ton of questions right away so you're not interrogating them. Although you want to get down to the nitty gritty, maybe they have a really slow roundabout way of telling you things. Cause my, my son drives me crazy when he tells me a story. I'm like, please, just, what are we even doing here? Tell me, tell me what the story's about. So, um, so yeah, just remain calm, be patient. And, and then I, I think a really good question is, um, well tell em we're gonna be okay.

Clay Cranford: (36:22)

This is, this is not the end. Like we'll be okay. And then ask them, what do you, what would you like to see happen here? Mm. Okay. Ask you like, like, what would be for you  best outcome? Okay. And, and just let 'em kinda share it with you, like what they're thinking. But I mean, they, I want your kid to feel like they're part of the solution so they kinda get some power back. 'cause they feel completely, you know, disassociated, helpless, any power helpless. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And then, and then say, okay, well we have some options. Right? Um, so number one, we're we're not gonna, we're not gonna pay them. Like, that's simple. Um, if, if you give that person even an inkling that you will pay them, you, you, you will, you will be bombarded. So just to just you. And in fact, a lot of parents are like, they just messaged the person and say, “Look, I'm a parent.This is not happening.”

Clay Cranford: (37:11)

 It's a numbers game. As soon as they realize you're not gonna pay, they move on. Really? Oh, okay. They, they don't, they don't have a lot of energy and time for someone who's a dry hole. They're just gonna move on. So, and then you're like, okay, um, like, we need to, uh, block this person. Um, I, I would recommend you, you tell other people in that network that this person is a scammer and that they should block 'em too. Um, I would also, um, if if they actually do have an image, you can go to the National Center for Miss Exploited Children's website and use their tool called Take It Down. Mm-Hmm. , which, um, they, it's basically the same technology that law enforcement's been using for taking down, um, child sex abuse material. And, uh, they, they don't actually take the image.

Clay Cranford: (38:03)

So you, you're not uploading an image to their tool. They take a fingerprint, a hash value of that image. It's like these, it's like the metadata. It's not the, it's not the image itself. And then they share that with some, some social media platforms, like I think Instagram, Facebook, not Snapchat, uh, some other ones. And, and, and then if that image appears on their platform, they will, they'll just take it down. It'll just get automatically deleted. So, there's kind of a thing you can do after the fact. And then, and then what I would, and then you can also report it to the National Center for Missing Exploited Children using their cyber tip line. They, they have a, they have a form that you can fill out and then you could share it with your law, your local law enforcement. But again, you know, this is probably coming from a country on the other side of the planet, there have been successful prosecutions of the money mules.

Clay Cranford: (38:59)

So these are the people who live in the United States who take, basically get the money. And then they transfer the money overseas. So a lot of times they'll say, Hey, I want you to buy $500 in these cash cards. Mm-Hmm. like greendot cards or something like that. And then you, and then you give it to the Money Mule. And the Money Mule then wires the money to the people overseas. So, oh. So, uh, and, and sometimes the Money Mule is a somebody who's been a victim and they're being extorted to do it. 

Hillary Wilkinson: (39:30)

Oh. And that's how they're being extorted. Sure. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Thank you. Okay, so we have to take a short break, but when we come back, I am going to ask the cyber safety cop for his healthy screen habit. 

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Hillary Wilkinson:

My guest today is Clay Cranford, the Cyber Safety Cop and dad of 2. Clay, when I picture you giving presentations at school, I can only picture the, uh, the kids' picture book by Peggy Rathman. Are you familiar with it? Officer Buckle and Gloria, it's a story about,

Clay Cranford: (40:39)

No, I don't know that one.

Hillary Wilkinson: (40:40)

Oh my gosh, I love it. It's a story about a police officer and his canine partner and the safety assemblies they do at school, and it's, uh, I highly recommend it. The illustrations are very funny. It's, it's a very good, I'm a fan of picture books. On every episode of the Healthy Screen Habits podcast. I ask for a healthy screen habit, which is a tip or takeaway that our listeners can put into place nearly immediately. What is yours?

Clay Cranford: (41:15)

Do I, do I give you one or more than one?

Hillary Wilkinson: (41:17)

You gave me three

Clay Cranford: (41:18)

I know I gave you three. I got like 20, but yes, 

Hillary Wilkinson: (41:22)

Yes. 

Clay Cranford: (41:23)

Do, um, well, I, yeah, I, I, I would recommend that, um, my, one of my number one things is I tell parents to wait, don't, don't give your child, um, a phone or social media too soon. Um, I, I feel like we're doing that because we're anxious parents and not because our kids actually need it. Um, number two, I would say, you know, I wouldn't give my child, don't give my child a smartphone until they're in high school. If, if your child, if you need to give your child a phone before that, give them a flip phone, give 'em an Apple watch something that you can communicate with 'em, but doesn't have access to social media apps. And then I would wait till they're 16 to give 'em social media. And at least that gives them the old time, you know, getting through puberty, uh, without being on a stage, um, social media is actually really, really good for them.

Clay Cranford: (42:12)

And the opposite would be, um, it's horrifying, right? Uh, so I, I I, I do recommend that wait as long as you can and, um, and, and then also be very careful about what apps you say yes to. So, um, like we said, I would never say yes to Snapchat, not in a million years. And, um, but if you say yes to an app, then you need to have a game plan on how you're gonna monitor that. And I think OurPact is a great choice. I have some other, um, tips in my book, Parenting In The Digital World, but also on my website@cybersafetycop.com. So take a look at that and, um, you know, there's always something new. So, I mean, that's the kind of the, it's a good thing for us as educators 'cause it always keeps us kind of interested in, we always have some new material, right, , but for parents, it's really frustrating uh, visit my website. I have a blog, uh, every other week about something important for you. So take a look at that. You can join my, um, my free membership. And, um, other than that, happy parenting!

Hillary Wilkinson: (43:18)

It's quite an adventure . It's indeed. As always, you can find a complete transcript of this show and a link to all of the resources discussed, including links to Cyber Safety Cops website by visiting the show notes for this episode. You do this by going to healthy screen habits.org click the podcast button and scroll to find this episode. Clay, thank you so much for being here, but especially for a life spent in service of others, protecting our kids, both on and offline.

Clay Cranford: (43:52)

Thank you, Hillary. It's really been a blessing having that career, and I, I'm glad I can continue doing it, and thanks for having me on.