For more info: Reset Summer Camp



Unhappy Campers: Amazon Book Link

Hillary Wilkinson (00:41):

As we round the corner on spring. So many of us are looking ahead to summer months and summer fun. And for many families, this includes a stint at summer camp. Summer camp is a magical rite of passage for many. And there's, there's this saying, living 10 for two. And that means that summer campers and staff wait 10 months out of the year just to be at camp for two. So my guest today figured out how to get more of those summer camp days out of his life by combining his knowledge of digital wellness with his experiences as a camp director for over 40 years. In the summer of 2018, he started the world's first clinical summer camp program for teens and adolescents suffering from unhealthy screen time, social media use, and gaming addiction. You may remember him from before Reset. Summer Camp is a camp for digital detox and life skills. I had the opportunity to visit reset summer camp in its Santa Barbara location, and I quite frankly, was ready to stay. <laugh>, his latest project is a book called Unhappy Campers, and we're gonna take a deep dive into that. But before we get any further, just welcome back to the Healthy Screen Habits podcast. Michael Jacobus.

Michael Jacobus (02:15):

Hi. Thank you very much. I'm excited to return.

Hillary Wilkinson (02:18):

Yay. I'm excited you're here. So, in case we have listeners that haven't had a chance to go back kind of into the archives or look up our, our previous conversation or anything else around reset summer camp, let's do a little bit of background building first. And can you tell us, I, I I, can you just tell us what reset Summer Camp is and why you created it?

Michael Jacobus (02:42):

Sure. Absolutely. Uh, reset Summer camp is, like you said, a digital detox and life skills program for teenagers. It's four weeks long. We have two licensed therapists on staff 24 7, and it's housed on a university campus. So kids, uh, stay in dorms, they have roommates, we have set bedtimes. We have a very strict eating schedule. Um, and it's sort of designed to give kids a feel for what it's gonna be like when they go off to college or move out of home and get an apartment with, uh, likely roommate. Um, the sleeping and the eating schedule are two of the most critical things that we do. Um, we call them life skills because, uh, without proper sleep you can't really do anything. And, uh, obviously proper nutrition and exercise and everything else we do is, uh, super important too. You know, upwardly mobile healthy living.

Hillary Wilkinson (03:37):

Yeah. Yeah. So it, that kind of sounds a lot like other summer camps I have known. What do you do specifically to address the, um, the, the digital detox sort of side of things?

Michael Jacobus (03:50):

Well, unlike the many summer camps that I've worked at in my 40 years, um, kids who come to this program are not excited to be attending. Uh, they feel like they're being punished. Uh, their folks are forcing them to come. They don't wanna put down their phones or leave their computers. Um, typically, you know, the boys who come are more into the video games. The girls who come are more into social media. So they are really stripped bare of their electronics and uh, you know, they have very horrible social skills, very horrible in-person, real world relationship skills. They all are looking at their feet. They don't know where to look. Um, and like I said, none of them wanna be there. So it actually creates a kind of an us against them tribal environment because they're in a roommate, you know, situation with somebody else who doesn't wanna be there. So, um, it's actually amazing how good sleep and good nutrition make the anxiety and depression disappear, uh, in about a week, week and a half.

Hillary Wilkinson (04:50):

Yeah. I can understand why you need a full four weeks to do that. 'cause you probably spend that first week just like, I mean, like it says like detoxing off of

Michael Jacobus (05:01):

Yeah, absolutely. I tell my staff not to plan on getting a lot of sleep the first week. Um, mostly kids, the kids who come are used to being up till 1, 2, 3 in the morning. Um, and you know, their eating habits are horrible. They're eating Doritos and drinking Gatorade at midnight. Um, so we put 'em to bed at nine 30 and lights out at 10 and no kid in today's world is ready to go to sleep at that time. But then we wake them up at six 30 to gather at seven and be at breakfast at seven 30. And, you know, they're all sleepy and grumpy at least the first week, you know, and by the second week it's routine and, you know, the third and the fourth week just build upon that. And that's why we called it reset 'cause we're resetting them to who they were before they got digitally addicted.

Hillary Wilkinson (05:44):

Right, right. And it's, um, I think it's interesting you talk about that a lot of the girls come there. There does seem to be this gender divide where the girls seem to be more heavily engaged in social media and the, the boys, um, tend to be more heavily engaged with the gaming. And I think streaming hits both, to be very honest with you. But, um, when you pull those devices, I feel like part of the the reset is got to be a reset of their identity because a lot of their identity becomes wrapped up in those online platforms.

Michael Jacobus (06:24):

Oh, absolutely. That, that's why I I say, you know, their, their social skills are, are really horrible. They're used to communicating in chat boxes or in, you know, discord windows, using emojis and abbreviations and, and to actually have to communicate a full sentence to, uh, a peer or much less a counselor or me the camp director, is, uh, a really a big challenge. Yeah. And it's funny because a lot of them, you know, are they, they feel bullied or out of place, you know, that's just sort of the generational thing that is consistent these days. And, you know, at at reset they're all part of the family, you know, it doesn't matter how quirky they are or, or you know, how weird they are. 'cause we're all weird. So, you know, they, they actually get into kind of a real good group mode. And, and by the end of camp, you know, they're, they're hugging and exchanging, you know, Instagram or cell phone numbers with each other 'cause they don't wanna leave 'cause they've made new real world friends.

Hillary Wilkinson (07:22):

Yeah. Yeah. So that just kind of brings me back to the last time that you and I got to hang out. We were at this, I mean, gorgeous college campus and one of your summer camp sessions was underway. And I met your staff. I met campers. Um, clearly this was beyond the first week that you talk about that kind of like storming <laugh> first week. But I did not see anybody who looked to be unhappy. But the title of your new book is Unhappy Campers. So what made you choose this title?

Michael Jacobus (08:03):

Uh, well I, I've had that title in my head for a quite a few years actually. And I think it's, uh, a play on the Happy camper Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> phrase because, you know, everyone's a happy camper at camp and everything's just fun and rosy and beautiful. And I deal with kids who, like I said, don't wanna come. They don't wanna participate. They feel punished. They're very unhappy campers when they arrive. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Um, and, and the book is kind of taken off the transcripts of our online course that we created, uh, over the past winter. Um, so it, it's, it sort of goes hand in hand. We, we created the online course for parents because we're just a summer camp program. So, you know, when I get emails from parents saying, Hey, when's your next program? And they're e contacting me in October, you know, I I have to say July. Yeah. Good luck. Yeah. So we created, it's

Hillary Wilkinson (08:54):

A long,

Michael Jacobus (08:55):

Yeah. So we created an online program for parents to do at home. Granted, it's more difficult to do it in the home environment than to send your kid to a digital detox. Um, but the result is pretty much the same because when, when I have parents ask me if our program is guaranteed, for example, I always laugh and I'll say, absolutely not. Uh, I can guarantee to detox your kid 'cause they're gonna be with me for a month without their devices. But then we're gonna send them home to where the problem originated. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So are you, as the parents going to take the advice that we send you every week and the emails, are you gonna show up to our parent workshop and participate in the family group therapy? Are you going to enter into a behavioral contract for your child, which we do during the parent workshop?

Michael Jacobus (09:41):

Are you going to review your own habits with technology? 'cause you're setting the example? Are you gonna change the home environment, get the computers out of the kids' bedrooms, things like that. So yeah, it's a hundred percent guaranteed if you buy in and you participate and you do what we recommend you do. Um, but, you know, just, you know, it's, I tell parents all the time, this is not a fix my kid issue. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> it's a fix the family dynamic issue. And that's, that's the hurdle that we really struggle to get over with parents.

Hillary Wilkinson (10:13):

Right, right. Well we have to take a little break, but when we come back, we're gonna talk more about Michael's new book as well as get tips for keeping tech in its lane during summer, months and year round. 

Ad Break: Troomi

Hillary Wilkinson:

I'm speaking with Michael Jacobus, the internationally recognized author, child development specialist and camp professional.  He has an extensive background in youth and outdoor education and the combination of all of these things is the foundation for his book Unhappy Campers, how technology, social media and online gaming are creating a generation of unhappy, depressed and angry kids. Whoa, <laugh>. It's good. I like the title 'cause it digs right, right into the heart of the problem. And as you were just discussing before the break, you stated that the tech issues most families face are a family dynamic issue, not a fix my kid issue. And can you talk about maybe how that, that family dynamic comes into play and how systems get set up?

Michael Jacobus (12:22):

Sure. Um, two of the first things that we talk to parents about either in the online course or screening to bring their kid to camp is, um, are both parents on the same page. Because very often we'll have one parent who sees a real technology addiction issue and the other parent thinks it's no big deal. And so I have to tell both parents, if one of you thinks it's a big deal, it's a big deal. So, so you need to get on the same page. And the other thing that we need to address is, um, getting your kid assessed. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you know, I would say at least half of the kids who come to our program have very obvious diagnosable conditions, be it a DD, autism, you know, mild Asperger's, you know, whatever it is. And they've never been assessed, they've never seen a therapist, they have no medication.

Michael Jacobus (13:11):

And so that right there creates an uphill battle. And I can't tell you how many times I tell parents it is not a personal failure on your part if your child has a behavioral or a cognitive challenge. Um, what's funny is we don't get a lot of referrals because parents are, uh, embarrassed that they had to send their kid to our program in the first place. You know, we get some very wealthy families. We had a, a very, uh, popular Hollywood star. Uh, her, her kid came to camp last summer. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But if I told you her name, you would know it immediately. But she won't give us a referral because she's too embarrassed that she had this problem in the first place. Which is fine. We don't push for referrals and, and we understand the nature of the program. But I was talking to somebody yesterday and they said, that's so weird because everybody has this problem for sure.

Michael Jacobus (14:00):

Um, but, uh, but the family shame and the family guilt is, is, is huge. And, and uh, when I speak to parents, it's funny, I'll show them, uh, in, in my book there's a picture of, uh, the Andrea Gale from the Perfect Storm movie. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I'll show them the picture of the boat, uh, you know, on a quiet palm sea. And I'll say, this is what my parents had to deal with when I was a kid, you know, 'cause I had to go to an arcade and bring quarters and things like that. And then I'll show the final picture of that vote where it's about to be crushed by the tidal wave and go upside down and kill everybody. And I'll say, this is what today's parents have to deal with because the constant 24/7 bombardment, all the notifications, all the in-app purchases, everything that was not around when we were kids is hitting your kids 24/7.

Michael Jacobus (14:50):

Right. So, um, the other thing we talk to parents about is nonjudgmental communication. Because I will talk to parents, you know, and, and I get asked to speak about, you know, the dangers of social media. Right. I'll go and I'll speak to a parent group for 10 or 15 minutes and then I'll say, now you can forget everything I said. Because while I've been talking, six new platforms have been launched, eight new games have come out. You know, there is no way a parent in today's world can keep on top of every parental control app, every game, every social media. You know, there's no way you can do it other than clear non-judgmental communication with your kid. And by that I mean, if your kid is into video games, sit down and create a character and play the game with them. You might think it's the stupidest thing in the world, but it drives them. So learn about what it is that drives them.

Hillary Wilkinson (15:42):

Yeah. And then you can speak the same language on it as well.

Michael Jacobus (15:45):

At least, at least a little bit. Yeah. You know, and then same thing, you know, typically with daughters who are into social media, ask to see your daughter's social media and, and just ask to see what she's posting, who's posting on hers, who's commenting, say, thank you and walk away and do it again. You don't wanna say, oh my God, you posted a picture of yourself wearing that because A, it's already happened. And b that's judgmental. If you want to communicate with your teen, you have to meet them where they are, not where you wish they were being. Oh goodness. And obviously the other thing is we, we talk about removing technology from the bedroom. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And not just the kids' bedroom, but the parents' bedroom too. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But if your kid is into video gaming that moved that computer to the family room or the kitchen or the dining room, some sort of family public place, not in their bedroom where they can close the door and stay up till two in the morning, you know, and then sleep obviously is, is the most important. We, we recommend taking the charging cords and the phones and the power cords to the y you know, anything you have to do to get your kids offline at 10 o'clock at night so they can get eight hours of uninterrupted sleep.

Hillary Wilkinson (16:54):

Right. Right. And we, we recommend charging devices in the primary bedroom bathroom. Yeah. Um, it protects your own sleep because you're not kept up by the dings all night. But it also kind of starts a, a layer a boundary. Kids are less likely to try to access those charging devices if they have to enter the parents' bedroom to get to

Michael Jacobus (17:19):

The bathroom. Well, and we have some parents that will put power strips in the closet of their master bedroom Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and then put a padlock on the closet door.

Hillary Wilkinson (17:26):

Oh wow.

Michael Jacobus (17:27):

Um, I mean, it's that extreme. Yeah, sure. And, and the, some of the parents I talk to say, well, my kid will have a tantrum if I turn off the wifi. And I'll say, yeah, yeah. So it will pass. Right. The kids at camp have tantrums the first week.

Hillary Wilkinson (17:41):

Right, right. Excuse me. Right. And it

Michael Jacobus (17:44):

Passes.

Hillary Wilkinson (17:44):

Yeah. In psychology, they talk about something called the Sunset effect where it's going to get worse before it gets better.

Michael Jacobus (17:51):

Yeah. But it will get better.

Hillary Wilkinson (17:52):

I agree. I agree. So, um, I think in touching on that, I so many parents feel baffled and helpless by how quickly their child's temperament can change once, once kind of devices enter the chat, if you will. Once the, once kids are given their own devices, um, what do you have recommendations on how to navigate? We have this kind of ongoing conflict of parents needing to communicate with their child per se, after school practices, rehearsal, I mean pick, pick any Tuesday afternoon, whatever is going on. Uh, do you have any recommendations on how parents set that up while not relying on, say, smart devices?

Michael Jacobus (18:44):

Well, there, there's a couple schools of thought on that. I mean, you can go totally low tech, you can get your, get a flip phone for example. Or I think Bark has, there's a couple companies that have their own phones that don't do social media. They just do phone calls and text messages. Um, I'm not really a fan of that because we live in a technology universe. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, it, it seems to be better to have open communication with your kid. Um, we recommend turning off all notifications. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, um, unless it's from a live person that, you know, in the real world, like a text message from mom and dad. Um, but, uh, you know, nobody cares if Candy Crush misses you. You know, so, I mean, and we had a kid, um, at camp a couple years ago, I think he had 30,000 notifications by the fourth week of camp, and they were all game notifications.

Michael Jacobus (19:32):

Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And that's ridiculous. You know, and, and we would talk to him, you know, what, what did you do? What did you learn? What new friends did you make? What experiences did you have versus, uh, paying attention to these 30,000 notifications. And, and he made the realization that they were useless and actually turned them off on his phone. Um, so, so that's kind of what parents are up against. And, and one of the reasons I talk about open non-judgmental communication is these are young adults and they're gonna become adults. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So if you want them to be successful, uh, adults when they leave home and you want them to leave home, you know, I, I ask roomfuls of parents, how many of you want your kid living with you when they're 25? Nobody raises their hand. And at camp, I ask the kids the same thing, do you wanna still live with your parents when you're 25? Nobody raises their hand. And I'll say, you are on track for just that unless you get a handle on these screen addictions. So it's really a matter of parents being the parent and being okay to be the parent and not the pal. You know, their, their kids will have plenty of friends their whole lives. They only have one set of parents. So it's okay to set boundaries. It's okay to have restrictions. It's okay to have punishments. It's okay to have limitations. You're the parent. You need to guide your child into adulthood.

Hillary Wilkinson (20:54):

Right.

Michael Jacobus (20:55):

No, I heard, uh, I heard a great quote the other day. It said, when you give your kid a phone, you're not allowing them access to the world. You're allowing the world access to them. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So, so, you know, again, you need to routinely daily, if necessary, check in with your kid to see what they're doing online.

Hillary Wilkinson (21:16):

Yeah. Yeah. So speaking of all the notifications and handy apps that are all on our phones, reset has an app <laugh>.

Michael Jacobus (21:26):

We do.

Hillary Wilkinson (21:26):

Can, can you, can you talk about what types of things are, are covered on the app? Like why, like, I I, I haven't had a chance to explore it. I'm embarrassed to admit, but

Michael Jacobus (21:36):

<laugh> No, that's fine. Uh, and our app is, is funny because we are a digital detox program. And here we have an app, but the app is very boring. I I tell people straight up, it's a very boring app. It's, it's meant to provide a daily recommendation or suggestion for how teens can live their best life. And it's all things that we cover in camp. Um, it's also recommended for parents if for no other reason to start a conversation at the dinner table.

Hillary Wilkinson (22:03):

Okay.

Michael Jacobus (22:04):

Um, there's about eight videos on that app. Um, you know, everything from how to pump a tank of gas, how to use an ATM, how to, uh, fix a flat tire, you know, just life skill things. But that's all it does. It provides a daily notification and there's a few videos you can watch. There's no communication, there's no chat, there's no sharing there, there's nothing interactive about it other than the daily notification

Hillary Wilkinson (22:30):

<laugh>. Excellent. So it sounds like it's one of those, um, we call it like a bridging device where it bridges online life and offline life.

Michael Jacobus (22:41):

Yeah, absolutely. And you know, if if you subscribe to the app and you do the daily recommendations, you'll live a happier life. That's really all there is to it.

Hillary Wilkinson (22:51):

Yeah. Yeah. So I am sure we have, we have listeners from all over and I am sure they're leaning forward trying to figure out where Reset summer camp is located and if their child would be a good candidate and all of these things. Can you tell us about locations for summer 2024 and like any other further details in the works?

Michael Jacobus (23:16):

Yeah. Um, reset in the US is in Santa Barbara, California. And that program starts July 7th, uh, in Canada. It's up in Quebec, so it's on the other side of the country, just north of Vermont. And that program starts the following week, so July 14th. Um, but it runs for four weeks. Uh, we have kids from all over the country. We even get some internationals, um, because it's such a specialized camp. And what's funny is people don't really sign up until this month or the next month. Right. Versus a traditional camp where I'm, you know, signing kids up before they leave, you know, this year for next year. Um, but that's also part of the parental shame and guilt and, you know, how did I let this happen to me kind of thing. Um, so, uh, and, and we're a really small program. We, we max out at 24 campers.

Michael Jacobus (24:06):

We have a three to one camper to staff ratio. And that's because most of the kids don't wanna be there. And, you know, we have two li licensed therapists on staff. Like I said, um, group therapy happens three days a week. Individual therapy happens every day, but it's much more organic. There's no set schedule. It'll happen when we're sitting on the beach or when we're walking to lunch. You know, our, uh, primary therapist has a therapy dog and that dog must go for 10 walks a day with 10 different kids. Um, and the individual therapy is obviously very specific to that kid and that kid's issues and whatever's going on in their lives. The group therapy is more general, uh, just to kind of let them know why they're here and what their parents want outta the program and what they want, or they could get, you know, the first week is very mild and we get deeper and deeper as the weeks progress.

Hillary Wilkinson (24:57):

Okay. So I have one last question before we go to break. And that is, it's, it's cost based because you kind of bridge this line between strictly recreational summer camp and rehab of sorts. Um, I, I kinda like to talk cost. Do, does insurance cover any of the cost? And then you did a really great job on your website of breaking down comparisons between what, what a full-time rehab camp Yeah. Would cost and

Michael Jacobus (25:29):

Yeah. The, the, it's funny because we're, we're kind of on the fence between the summer camp and a residential treatment center. So, you know, we're, uh, 78 50 for the four weeks. That's $7,850 that covers everything except the transportation of the kid to and from the program. Uh, and the parents' accommodations for the family workshop weekend at the end. 'cause we have parents that choose to stay on campus, and we have parents that choose to stay in nearby hotel. And I am not a travel agent, so I don't book that stuff. Um, but we do have tuition assistance available. Um, but we don't send that out unless it's requested. And that's after you've been accepted into the program. So it's not an upfront thing. But, uh, from in the world of summer camp, we're very expensive in the world of a residential treatment program. We are by far the cheapest game in town.

Michael Jacobus (26:17):

Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So it, it, you know, that we kind of have to dance on that fence line too, to get parents to understand that we are much more than a summer camp. We are a life skills development program. Um, and it's funny, we, um, didn't expect any kids to return. You know, we're coming into our seventh year and every year we have one or two kids that wanna come back. And it's not because they've gone back to the dark side, it's because their parents appreciated the month off tech. And they expressed a desire to help the next batch of campers. So we sort of created a junior staff position without really ever meaning to, because we had returners, um, which was very surprising to me. I figured, you know, we'd get them detoxed and next year they'd go to horseback riding campers sailing camper surf camp or something else. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, uh, didn't expect him to come back.

Hillary Wilkinson (27:05):

Oh, well it clearly that's, you know, the proof is in the pudding. <laugh>.

Michael Jacobus (27:10):

Right.

Hillary Wilkinson (27:11):

Okay. We have to take a short break, but when we come back, I am going to ask Michael Jacobus for his healthy screen habit. 

Ad Break:  BARK

Hillary Wilkinson:

My guest today is Michael Jacobus, founder of Reset Summer Camp, and author of Unhappy Campers: How Technology, Social Media, and Online Gaming Are Creating a Generation of Unhappy, Depressed and Angry Kids. So we have a few minutes, and Michael, before I ask you for your healthy screen habit, I want to know, do you have a favorite camp memory, either from your own childhood or as in your adult life? You, I mean, you cracked the code on how to, how to make this a, uh, a life journey, if you

Michael Jacobus (29:12):

Will. Yeah, I, I have wonderful memories every summer, you know, since when I was a kid. But my, my favorite most recent memory is, is the group hug at the end of, uh, four weeks of reset during the family workshop. When, when the kids are saying goodbye for the last time and they don't wanna go to me, that that means we've really made an impactful difference. You know, and the parents are sharing their contact information. We had some parents schedule, you know, a pool party a week after camp for kids who lived in California because we get kids from all over. Um, and, and to me, that's, that's the whole purpose of reset. So that's, that's my favorite current camp memory.

Hillary Wilkinson (29:51):

That's fantastic. So as you remember from before, on every episode of the Healthy Screen Habits Podcast, I ask for a healthy screen habit. And this is a tip or takeaway our listeners can put into place nearly immediately. What's yours?

Michael Jacobus (30:08):

Yeah. Uh, immediately you can put into practice good sleep and, and kind of, we've already talked about it, but I would, I recommend that you have a family dinner, which you should be having regularly anyway. And, uh, even apologize to your kids or your family and say, you, you know, I really didn't realize how much sleep deprivation deals with, you know, anxiety, depression, low grades, you know everything that's going on in your home, and I recommend you do this on Wednesday. And so you announce after the apology that as of Sunday, so they got a couple days to get used to it. As of Sunday, we're gonna turn in all our phones, all our tablets, all our iPads, all our power cords to computers and the wifi at 9 o'clock on Sunday night so that we can be asleep by 10 o'clock. And you put all that in the parent's master closet if you have to lock it, lock it, and then you don't give those things back until the morning and until they're like leaving for school, not at 6:00 AM, and the whole goal is to get eight hours of sleep a night. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And, you know, if every parent would do that, the depression and anxiety would drop by over half and they wouldn't need to send them to my program.

Hillary Wilkinson (31:28):

Right. So your goal is to put yourself out of business

Michael Jacobus (31:31):

Yeah. Every time I tell, you know, I get asked to talk to elementary school parents once in a while and I'll, I'll go and I'll talk and I'll explain who I am and what I do, and then I'll say, “Please do not create a situation where you need to send your kid to my program.”  Because, you know, at the elementary school level, parents have total control over that. Uh, but you know, so many of them, every time I see a kid in a restaurant with a rubber covered iPad, I think “future camper”. Mm. You know, because they're getting addicted at such a young age.

Hillary Wilkinson (32:02):

Right, right. Okay. Well thank you as always. You can find a complete transcript of this show and a link to all of the resources discussed by visiting the show notes for this episode, including a link to Michael's latest book. Do this by going to healthy screen habits.org. Click the podcast button and find this episode. Michael, thank you so much for all that you do. Um, keeping Summer Camp a priority, keeping outdoors a priority, and teaching healthy tech handling to keep kids outside, outside and talking.

Michael Jacobus (32:40):

Yeah. Well, thank you. I appreciate the time.